Interview: Hans van Manen Remembers Photographer Erwin Olaf

The Stedelijk Museum in Amsterdam is at the moment internet hosting “Freedom,” the largest-ever retrospective of Dutch photographer Erwin Olaf (1959-2023). Spanning 4 many years, the exhibition reveals an artist whose meticulously staged photos reworked pictures into theater, charged with magnificence, pressure and management. From early portraits of nightlife and queerness to his later reflections on energy and vulnerability, Olaf’s lens captured each the poise and fragility of human presence.

For Olaf, dance was inseparable from pictures. The turning level got here in 1984 when he met Hans van Manen, already an internationally acclaimed choreographer and photographer, who instantly acknowledged the youthful artist’s intuition for composition. Their assembly marked the start of an enduring friendship and creative dialogue. Dance provided Olaf a language of self-discipline and precision: every motion, like every body, needed to be deliberate. His excessive close-ups of dancers turned flesh into sculpture, revealing the pressure, class and sheer labor of efficiency.

To coincide with the exhibition, Observer met Hans van Manen to revisit these early encounters and the artistic partnership that formed their practices. In our dialog, he displays on their trade, the teachings of sunshine and the choreography behind each {photograph}.

Let’s return to the beginning: when did you first meet Erwin Olaf and what struck you about him?

More than 40 years in the past. Erwin was working as a journalist for Sek, a queer journal then. He got here to {photograph} me for an interview, and we began speaking instantly. The following month, I photographed him. We had no cash on the time, however I nonetheless keep in mind when he bought his first Hasselblad digital camera. That’s an enormous second for any photographer. From then on, we had a improbable relationship. We talked about pictures continuously.

He was 24 then. How do you keep in mind him at that age?

Very inquisitive about artwork and pictures. When he got here into my home, he was stunned by what was on the partitions. I had an vital assortment of Robert Mapplethorpe pictures, which I later gave to the Rijksmuseum.

People typically name you a mentor in his seek for a voice.

We all the time exchanged concepts, and I had loads to say about what he photographed. Not criticism, extra like actual dialog. Erwin could have favored calling me a mentor, however I wouldn’t describe myself that manner. We had a deep friendship from the start till his demise.

But you launched him to wonderful artwork pictures…

I talked to him concerning the energy of method and the magic of sunshine. Sometimes one mild is sufficient to create miracles. I developed 150 ballets and sometimes did the lighting design, so I do know mild. For me, it wasn’t tough to get it proper after I photographed. Erwin used mild in a different way as a result of he labored on a big scale, which demanded one other strategy. If you evaluate his early and late footage, you see how his lighting developed. Technique is important, however when you grasp it, it’s important to add your character. You must put your self in.

How did Olaf affect you?

Not a lot in my work. I knew what I needed, and he knew what he needed. He most popular listening to talking. He would possibly present me ten footage, I’d give suggestions, however he wasn’t very vital of me. Also, he confirmed me greater than I confirmed him.

Let’s communicate concerning the exhibition on the Stedelijk.

I’m positive it is going to be an amazing success. Many individuals who have by no means seen Erwin’s footage will uncover his work. I attempt to perceive how laborious it’s to arrange a retrospective. How do you current an entire life and divide it into rooms? It’s tough to create a balanced rhythm with pictures. Some elements really feel full, others minimal. Some good footage are lacking, too. I’m strict as a result of I’ve seen all of them.

How about its title, “Freedom?”

Erwin was a freethinker, completely emancipated, and that drove him. From the nightclubs to the battle for equal rights and activism. But there’s all the time a wonderful line between somebody’s life, his work and what leads to an exhibition.

Some footage sparked debate on the time for being controversial. How did he deal with criticism?

We photographed many nude males, and we discovered it regular. Early on, there have been dangerous feedback as a result of individuals interpreted the pictures in silly methods, however that modified during the last 20 years. Erwin additionally photographed many nude girls, in such a lovely manner that no different photographer within the Netherlands did. Of course, individuals largely speak concerning the males.

In the exhibition, there’s a bit on dance, together with Dance in Close-Up, made on your ninetieth birthday. What stays with you from making it?

I spent three weeks exhibiting Erwin documentation of all my ballets, and he selected what to make use of. Then we spent a full week within the studio with the dancers. I directed them, and Erwin made the images. It was an amazing coordination, and the pictures grew to become a improbable guide. In the present, there are solely slow-motion movies from my works Trois Gnossiennes and Two Pieces for HET. They’re lovely, however they weren’t simple to movie. You must be exact with the dancers’ positions. One video has a elevate, the opposite a pirouette. You should give actual instructions on when and the place to start out and cease. The dancers want particular power for a spotless consequence. These are very technical works. Erwin was all the time good with video.

This was your final mission collectively…

He cherished my ballets, and this was in all probability probably the most summary mission he ever did. He normally had a factor for storytelling, however not right here. On the final day, I informed him, let’s take an image the place we bow. So we stood there, hand in hand like we had been on stage, as if every thing had completed after seven days of laborious work. It’s not simple to be current up there for thus lengthy.

His photos are theatrical by design. Did he take pleasure in directing individuals on set?

Of course. If you look intently, yow will discover him in all the main points. He knew find out how to compose lovely footage. I consider his Im Wald sequence within the Bavarian woods. I’ve by no means seen woods like that. Nature is huge, and there’s just one small human. Because of that scale, you are feeling how majestic the place is. It’s very poetic. He had many such footage. That private work ran alongside the commissions and reveals the distinction between a ‘photographer’ and an ‘artist’.

Olaf as soon as mentioned, “I have become my photographs. What I create is me.” What do you want individuals understood about him past the pictures?

That he was open-minded and proactive. He all the time mentioned what he needed. I keep in mind he as soon as spat in somebody’s face as a result of the person mentioned one thing horrible. I informed Erwin he was mistaken and the one factor to do was apologize. A month later, he did. He was cheap ultimately. He spoke with the person, they usually settled it. He went far in every thing he did in public. An exhibition provides solely a tiny sense of who he was. A improbable individual. I cherished him very a lot.

Since his passing, has your reminiscence of him modified the way in which you watch dance or take a look at pictures?

The final time I noticed him, he had so many concepts—some severe and a few scandalous—and he shared them from his hospital mattress. It was deeply transferring. He was the one individual I may really speak to about pictures. It’s unusual that he isn’t right here, unusual to speak about footage that aren’t there. In choreography, I all the time set the beginning and the end so the piece holds. I attempt to give my reminiscences of him the identical construction, or they disintegrate.

Erwin Olaf’s “Freedom” is on view on the Stedelijk Museum Amsterdam by March 1, 2026.

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