Cristina Mittermeier and Paul Nicklen: A Love Story for the Planet

Cristina Mittermeier

I really feel like each time we get within the water, we’re signing a contract that claims “I’m willing to die”.

Narration

I’m so deeply moved by individuals who put themselves in extraordinary circumstances to doc the wonders of our world earlier than they disappear. That is Cristina Mittermeier and Paul Nicklen. They are wonderful nature photographers and both of them would’ve made an unbelievable visitor alone on this present. But seeing as they’re additionally romantic companions, I believed I’d invite them each, and I’m so blissful that they mentioned sure. The love that they’ve for this planet in addition to one another is infectious, and it’s that love that will get them via when instances get powerful.

Paul Nicklen

I don’t know in case you’ve met Cristina, however she doesn’t let me get down for very lengthy. She’s like, and it’s not normally like, “Oh my honey, let me hold you. Here’s some hot tea.” And so she’s like, “Suck it up, big boy. We got to get back to work. We got work ahead of us.”

Narration

I’m Willow Defebaugh, and that is The Nature Of, the place we glance to the character of our world for knowledge and concepts that change the way in which we dwell. This week, I’m sitting down with Cristina Mittermeier and Paul Nicklen to listen to tales of hope and reverence from the depths of the ocean to the ends of the earth.

Willow Defebaugh

Cristina and Paul, you’ve spent your lives documenting a number of the most extraordinary ecosystems on this planet, and we’re going to dive into all of it. But earlier than we do, I needed to ask you to share how your mutual love of documenting the pure world introduced you collectively. Tell us your love story.

Cristina

Paul is sweet at telling it.

Paul

Go forward, honey. Take it away.

Cristina

So the primary time I met Paul, he was on stage within the Grosvenor Auditorium at National Geographic, which is such an iconic place for photographers. And Paul was presenting his story on his encounter with the Leopard seal, which was an actual love story. And I used to be simply amazed by what speaker he was, and simply how humorous—Canadian, right down to earth—and simply the story of the leopard seal and the connection to animals. And I used to be like, wow. And there was a wrinkle. He was married to any individual else. So that was that.

Paul

And so had been you. But what occurred was the subsequent day that they had the large National Geographic photographers assembly and Cristina was there and there was just one chair left. And she goes, “Please sit next to me and flirt with me.” First phrases out of her mouth. And I’m kind of a brief circuit in my mind and I’m fairly intimidated and a bit of bit shy. She’s completely beautiful, sporting a wonderful Mexican kind of Spanish gown and all her jewellery. And look how lovely she is. And I used to be simply kind of overwhelmed at that second, however we grew to become actually good mates in a short time. And it was her management via conservation that made me in the end fall in love together with her, nevertheless it took years of working collectively as professionals. And then at some point I’m like, “I don’t want to be away from this woman as we fight for this planet.” So it was a three-, four-year transition from that second on.

Cristina

So all these years later, Willow, he nonetheless has not requested me to marry him.

Paul

Maybe we’ll do this on the podcast.

Willow

OK. Well, girls, in case you’re listening, you possibly can simply say “Flirt with me.” Take it from Cristina. Okay. Can we circle again to the seal story that enamored Cristina?

Paul

2003, tragically, a scientist was taken down and killed by a leopard seal. And as any individual who’s at all times … I used to be a polar bear biologist. I labored on totally different animals all over the world and quite a lot of the charismatic kind of scary animals, the grizzly bears. And I’ve been round these animals all my life and I hate it when an animal will get a nasty repute. And it was tragic that the scientist was killed, however I needed to go down and provides this animal a good shake and get to know if it was a vicious monster that’s out searching people or if it’s misunderstood. So my proposal was to get within the water with as many leopard seals as I may over a two-month interval in Antarctica and get to know them. And it was intimidating. They are 1,000 kilos. They are 12 ft lengthy. They are aggressively curious. They do like to pop and chunk boats.

And immediately, I simply met this huge dominant feminine leopard seal and she or he got here up and thrashed this penguin towards the boat and there’s blood and guts in every single place. And it was my buddy, Göran Ehlmé from Sweden who’s like, “Let’s get in the water. You got to go do this. ” And so simply to kind of suck up that worry and get in. And then for 4 days straight, she [the leopard seal] tried to feed me penguins. First, she tried to present me dwell penguins. Then she tried to supply me dying, weak penguins. And then at one level I had 5 useless penguins floating round me. And then she began to flop penguins on prime of my head and she or he’s poking me within the ribs and within the face together with her whiskers tickling me simply making an attempt to get me to eat.

And it was simply to see the nurturing kind of motherly care of this animal that’s so dominant, that would not determine why I used to be in her searching grounds. But the one cause could possibly be that I used to be in all probability ravenous and I’m in search of meals. And so the one factor that she grew to become OCD obsessive about was getting me to eat. And so the extra I refused her meals, the extra OCD she grew to become and the extra we kind of had this bond. But after 4 days of it, she received very pissed off. It was probably the most magical factor that’s ever occurred to me in our oceans. And yeah, in order that’s the story I used to be sharing on stage with photos and stuff once I met Cristina for the primary time.

Willow

I really like this. It’s such a transparent depiction of how storytelling can actually shift individuals’s notion round greater than human life. If you hadn’t taken up that task, then this animal would’ve simply continued to be seen as a killer.

Cristina

When you concentrate on Antarctica and simply how distant it’s, how lovely, how particular, how essential it’s for the well-being of the whole planet, after which to suppose that the Southern Ocean the place these animals dwell is just not protected. And so we use the story of the leopard seal as a leaping begin level to advocate for extra protections for Antarctica, and we’re nonetheless doing it right now. We nonetheless haven’t achieved the objective of defending the waters across the Antarctic Peninsula. There’s quite a lot of opposition from industrial fishermen and from international locations which might be all for extracting minerals in these distant pristine locations. So the battle continues.

Willow

And are you able to share a bit of bit extra about the way you see storytelling’s position in shifting the needle on conservation? And that’s a lot part of your work with Sea Legacy.

Cristina

Well, I’ve been engaged on this for a very long time, though ever since earlier than you had been born. And it’s very clear to me that whoever tells the story wins the battles. I imply, you possibly can see it in American politics right now. He who has the microphone and is telling the story captures the world’s creativeness. And in conservation, it’s at all times been extremely costly and tough to inform the story, to the purpose that a lot of the massive conservation organizations dedicate lower than 5% of their total funds to speaking—it’s simply an afterthought. And I believe that’s the place we’ve misplaced the battle for our planet. People are simply not conscious, they’re not , they don’t discover it fascinating like we do. And I believe via storytelling, we will truly deliver individuals into the dialog.

Paul

For me, I got here throughout it by luck. I used to be doing these scientific tales for National Geographic, overlaying science, exhibiting the info. And then lastly, I believe in 2007, I did this story about local weather change, concerning the lack of sea ice and the results it’s going to have on polar wildlife. And I went and pleaded to National Geographic. I’m like, “Let me write it. I grew up right here with the Inuit. I’ve been working up right here all my life and let me simply do a plea to the readers of National Geographic to care about these extremely fragile ecosystems. “

And they’re like, “Well, normally we don’t let photographers be writers.” But they mentioned, “Fine, we’ll let you have a shot at this.” So I wrote it and I used to be extra shocked than anybody, nevertheless it received the very best readership rating of any story within the earlier 10 years at National Geographic. I used to be shocked that this resonated. And that kind of grew to become my then, you employ highly effective anecdotal storytelling to attract individuals into the dialog to make that connection about why these ecosystems are so essential.

Cristina

But the opposite factor that we realized early on whereas working for National Geographic is for years, publications just like the journal had been telling photographers, OK, your job is to be invisible. You’re there to doc what’s taking place and also you take away your self from the story. And once I began the International League of Conservation Photographers, I believed, we’ve to flip that concept on its head. And it’s the photographer as an envoy for this factor that she or he is photographing that actually engages audiences. People wish to know what it feels wish to be within the water with a leopard seal or with a shark or with a whale.

Paul

Cristina was the primary one, actually, to coin the time period conservation images, which meant earlier than how one can archive prints and museums. It was a really highly effective turning level for therefore many people National Geographic photographers. So that’s kind of why I actually fell in love together with her as a result of she kind of took all of us misplaced sheep on the market as journalists and she or he was simply such a powerful girl, and exhibiting us a path ahead and actually making a distinction via storytelling and being part of the story. So that was a really huge turning level, I believe, not only for myself, however for the whole business.

Willow

There’s such an intimacy in your images, each of you. And I believe that in some methods, that phrase is developing for me as a result of it’s type of the antithesis to this sterile objectivity that I believe whether or not you’re a photographer or a author, or a scientist, it’s so baked into Western journalism and Western science, this concept that we’ve to be absolutely faraway from the tales that we’re telling. 

And I believe, significantly because it pertains to the pure world, that’s one thing we’re continually questioning with Atmos as a result of how does that contribute to this large separation and chasm? When tales—if we actually need them to achieve individuals in such a private means—I believe they should really feel private. They have to really feel like a bridge. And I believe you each embody the position of the photographer as a bridge.

Cristina

You’re proper. There’s received to be a vulnerability and an intimacy that permits individuals to return in, as a result of the language of science is so intimidating to most individuals. If you’re not a scientist, it’s inconceivable to learn a scientific paper and perceive what’s being mentioned. But {a photograph} is an invite. It actually lowers the value of entry for individuals to interact with. I believe that is an important dialog of our lives. And so we’re making an attempt to construct that bridge.

Willow

We’ll proceed on the thread of storytelling, however I did wish to take a second to only dive into each of your backgrounds and upbringing. Paul, you talked about that you simply grew up alongside the Inuit, and also you’ve talked about that this was a defining chapter of your life. Can you share a bit of bit about how that point formed you?

Paul

Yeah, completely. I used to be born in Saskatchewan, Southern Canada, and my household, they’re each farmers. My dad used to choose up my mother in school and his pig truck with all of the hay flying out of the vehicles, like actual Saskatchewan farmers. But my dad grew to become a mechanic. And then in 1972, he was provided a job to be the superintendent on this small neighborhood. So we lived at first in Iqaluit, which is the place of fish. It was a much bigger city with 2,500 individuals in it. 

And then from there, we rapidly moved to a spot referred to as Kimmirut, which is Lake Harbour. It was referred to as Lake Harbour again then, which had 1,190 Inuit individuals in it. There had been three non-Inuit households residing on this neighborhood. And there was no radio, clearly no computer systems again then. We didn’t also have a phone. You received to name out annually on the radio telephone, like your Christmas name.

So there was actually no cause to spend any time indoors. I simply liked the quiet. I liked the large vistas, the landscapes. I liked the thriller of those animals and seeing ptarmigan and Arctic hares and polar bears and caribou, after which simply to have the ability to stroll throughout the barren lands. And it labored its means deep into me in a short time. And I knew that … And then you definitely’re listening to all of the tales. The Inuit are unbelievable storytellers, each via their artwork, via soapstone carvings, via their lithograph work, via oral tales, and of their writings and their drawings and their tales. And it simply grabbed me by the guts. And I knew I used to be going to do one thing sometime that needed to do with defending it, however I didn’t know what. So the apparent job was to change into a biologist. And I used to be engaged on totally different species after which in a short time discovered that as a scientist, we had been simply managing hunters’ rights.

So most sustainable yields, what number of animals are you able to kill earlier than you drive the inhabitants down? And like one inhabitants, we had been engaged on the Bathurst caribou herd. When my final census we did there within the ‘90s, there were 500,000 Bathurst caribou herd. Now there’s 5,000 they usually’re nonetheless combating over who will get to kill the final 5,000. So we received that incorrect. Everything we touched, we received incorrect. And so I simply needed nothing to do with it. And I left very disgruntled and really pissed off after which started the lengthy journey of making an attempt to get into National Geographic and actually inform these essential tales. The science was essential, however what we had been doing it for was misaligned.

Willow

Cristina, you grew up in Mexico. Can you inform us a bit of bit about how your tradition formed your improvement as an individual and in addition your strategy to images?

Cristina

Yeah, I believe I used to be so fortunate to be born in Mexico as a result of I really like being Mexican. And I grew up just about like Paul, simply operating outdoors. And there was cow fields and chickens. And we lived very close by an Indigenous neighborhood within the state of Morelos, in Cuernavaca. And I grew very distant from the ocean, however my father was superb about bringing books. My brother at all times received wonderful books of the Jack Cousteau Adventures and the National Geographic Magazine. And the ladies and I, my sisters and I, received the Barbie doll coloring books, those that you simply used to chop the little clothes and put them on the … And I simply thought it was so boring. So I’d sneak into my brother’s bed room and browse his books when he was not wanting. Eventually I stole the books and I nonetheless have them.

And I believe it was the journey of it, the outline of the pure world. And fortunately, I grew up with quite a lot of nature round me and simply fascinated by what animals are doing: simply to sit down quietly and watch any creature be itself identical to, “What are they doing? What are they talking about?” To at the present time, I’m fascinated by it. So I struggled lots with the position of being a lady in a standard neighborhood. To at the present time, Mexico nonetheless has fairly outlined gender roles for women and men, however my mom was a giant champion of me. So once I mentioned I wish to go and change into a marine biologist, my father had a match as a result of that was not a correct job and we needed to do quite a lot of negotiation; and ultimately, I used to be allowed to change into an engineer—that was acceptable, and it turned out to be fisheries biology, so how one can ravage and pillage the ocean.

And by the point I graduated from college, we had been learning the economic course of for how one can can sea turtle meat that was bought in markets in Mexico. And so I knew I didn’t wish to have something to do with that. And that is the late Nineteen Eighties. And Paul, I don’t find out about you, however in college, we didn’t have any programs concerning the setting, about sustainability. Conservation biology didn’t exist. And it was type of irritating that your total college formation is about how one can exploit nature. So I knew that I didn’t wish to be any a part of that.

Willow

It’s actually staggering when you concentrate on the truth that conservation science is so comparatively new and what you’re sharing round each of you and each of your experiences, a lot of the sciences had been directed towards, how a lot can we exploit? How a lot can we get away with?

Cristina

To at the present time, to at the present time, the idea of most sustainable yield principally says, how a lot of this inhabitants can we extract earlier than the inhabitants collapses? And simply this yr or final yr in a paper, scientists mentioned, “Oops, we got it wrong.” It seems that animals don’t exist remoted in populations. They’re a part of bigger net ecosystems. And if you take one out, there is perhaps catastrophic penalties. And we’ve seen it repeatedly over and over and over, and but the world refuses to acknowledge that we simply can’t hold taking from nature the way in which we do.

Paul

I imply, the very fact we’ve misplaced 70% of biodiversity on Earth proper now, and we’re nonetheless figuring, how will we exploit it, is we’re asking all of the incorrect questions. We’re doing all of the incorrect issues and we’re simply driving this planet into the sixth mass extinction. So the toughest a part of what we do is choosing your self up every single day, understanding the information, being conscious. It sucks to care, however when you begin caring, there’s no going again. You have to only keep within the combat as a result of it’s the one factor that’s cathartic on this kind of typically miserable, unhappy, demoralizing journey that we’re on. But it’s like the great half about being a pair is that when Cristina’s down, I can decide her up. And once I’m down, which is extra usually than her on this journey, she picks me up on a regular basis. So you kind of assist one another keep within the combat with all these points.

Willow

You’ve witnessed devastating ecological adjustments up shut and up entrance in a means that so many individuals is not going to. How do you course of that if you get again from an expedition, for instance?

Cristina

Hey, Paul, you battle far more than I do.

Paul

Yeah, I believe I give myself a second to sulk and be unhappy and be offended and be scared and cry. And then it’s time to crawl out of it. I imply, in case you keep there, you’re not very efficient as a storyteller, as a conservationist, as a warrior. We’re like battle photographers. We’re on the entrance strains of the worst issues taking place to our planet. We had been simply working in Indonesia and you’ll’t even exit within the water at instances as a result of there’s an excessive amount of plastic floating round our boat once we’re on anchor. And you possibly can’t even put the dinghy within the water as a result of the plastic: You have 300 million individuals flushing their diapers and all their trash into the rivers and the ocean. And so that you simply get offended and scared; however then you definitely go searching you and there’s so many individuals doing good issues, and rapidly any individual simply made an development with the federal government in Asia.

Now you’ve lots of of volunteers working with, like, Sungai Watch choosing up the plastic. Now they’re turning it into furnishings. Now individuals are getting employed they usually’re—you simply kind of hold grabbing onto these optimistic threads they usually hold inspiring you to maintain going. So you permit your self to get down. I don’t know in case you’ve met Cristina, however she doesn’t let me get down for very lengthy. And it’s not normally like, “Oh my honey, let me hold you. Here’s some hot tea.” She’s like, “Suck it up, big boy. We got to get back to work. We got work ahead of us. Yeah, you got a Zoom call. We’re talking about the Antarctic and Southern Coalition right now. We got to go create this MPA. We got to do this.” So she’s at all times rallying everyone round her and I’m simply one in every of her troopers that she retains within the combat. So yeah.

Cristina

I simply love actually that there’s a task for everyone to play. And what I say to individuals, Willow, is cease asking me for permission to do one thing. Lots of people will sit within the viewers and say, “What can I do? ” Well, you inform me, what are you able to do? Can you set up some recycling or some trash pickup or simply host a lecture? There’s so many issues that anybody particular person can do. Paul and I had been studying concerning the World War II heroes that helped win the battle, although they weren’t a part of the army, they weren’t a part of the intelligence neighborhood. They had been simply common individuals. They’re referred to as wonderful amateurs who stepped as much as the plate to do no matter they may in any capability to assist win the battle. And that’s what we’re calling on everyone. Let’s be the wonderful amateurs that simply do no matter we will and simply step as much as it.

Willow

The wonderful amateurs. I really like that a lot as a result of there’s some type of imaginary barrier that exists the place individuals really feel like they should be specialists in conservation or local weather work or environmental sciences so as to get entangled. And at Atmos, we’re very obsessed with breaking down that barrier and simply serving to individuals see that we’d like each single individual.

Cristina

Yeah. And how cool it’s to put on a superhero go well with? Everybody has one. You look lovely if you placed on a wonderful gown and rise up on stage and that’s your superhero go well with. But for Poland, for me, it is perhaps sporting a wetsuit, even at virtually 60 and a bit of on the heavier aspect. It doesn’t matter. It’s the armor you placed on within the morning to say, “I am for this planet.”

Willow

Whether it’s a wetsuit or a corset.

Paul

Exactly. We actually have believed all alongside that the facility of the individuals’s higher than the individuals in energy. And if you hear that and also you’re like, “We just have to keep galvanizing a global movement.”

Cristina

Well, you impressed each of us tremendously together with your metaphor of sitting on the shores of the coast of British Columbia at night time across the campfire and ingesting. And Willow, inform us the story as a result of I believed it was such a wonderful method to discuss activism.

Willow

So I used to be in British Columbia lately and I used to be on Cortes Island, and each night time I used to be with a bunch of scientists and artists and writers. And each night time we’d go right down to the water and we might expertise bioluminescence. And what I liked a lot about it was that if you first look out into the water, it’s simply inky, black, full darkness in every single place you look. And if you truly wade into the water and also you create motion, then rapidly the bioluminescence begins to return to life and also you create mild. And that was such an essential lesson for me as a result of once we stand nonetheless, once we are on the shores of hopelessness, it appears like there’s solely darkness in every single place we glance. But once we truly step ahead in motion surrounded by different individuals, then we create the sunshine. And that’s how we step previous the continually asking, “Well, what can I do? What should I do?” Just get within the water. 

And I believe the opposite factor that it taught me is simply additionally that it creates a lot magnificence. That is probably the most lovely factor, is being in motion with different individuals. And I’d go right down to the water each single night time as a result of I liked seeing individuals’s faces for the primary time once they realized that their motion was what was creating it in collaboration with these microscopic beings within the water.

Cristina

Oh, so lovely. That’s very inspiring and so true.

Willow

I wish to spend a bit of time talking about the truth that you each have new books they usually each are titled two of my favourite phrases, and I wish to offer you each an opportunity to discuss them. Cristina, your e book is known as Hope.

Cristina

I began fascinated with this e book in a type of darkish moments once I was pondering every part is misplaced. And I believed, no, I have to construct myself an emotional life raft that I can maintain onto. And I made so many quotes of how I really feel about hope all through this e book, and the individuals and the wildlife that I photographed which might be nonetheless on the market, it offers me a lot hope to know that they nonetheless exist. And if individuals like me, individuals like us rise up within the morning to combat for it, we will nonetheless defend it. And it went on to be a really profitable publication now on its third reprint. And Paul’s about to publish his e book utilizing the identical methodology, simply getting our followers to change into a part of the story.

Paul

Yeah. And my e book, Reverence, is one thing I’ve at all times needed to speak about, however I’ve been shy to speak about it. But once I see the craziness of the world: I grew up Catholic, I grew up an altar boy, and my grandma used to pay me severe cash once I was 7 years previous to be taught all my Hail Marys and Our Fathers. And I kind of at all times tried to think about this world that exists after life on earth. Where will we go if we do every part proper whereas we’re right here and the way terrible is hell? And in the meantime, every single day I’m surrounded by the bioluminescence. I’ve been swimming with bioluminescence and there’s nothing extra lovely, or to stroll within the Great Bear Rainforest, and to see a wonderful white spirit bear come out beneath these old-growth timber which might be 200 ft tall, or to stroll throughout the plains of Torres del Paine towards these mountains with this puma at your ft or to see a polar bear.

So the reverence I’ve for nature and to appreciate that for me, heaven is right here and now. It doesn’t get any extra lovely and any extra highly effective than what’s in entrance of us now. And the truth that we’re squandering and killing this lovely planet of ours, ready for this subsequent life, if you notice that you simply’re residing right here and now in heaven. It doesn’t get any higher than this. When you spend time in nature and also you look an animal within the eye, otherwise you stand there on the aspect of a river stuffed with 1000’s of salmon, and to listen to the ravens and the wolves howling within the forest, you possibly can’t think about something extra highly effective and delightful than what we’ve in entrance of us. And we’ve to combat to guard this. And that is the reverence I’ve for this planet proper now.

Willow

I couldn’t agree extra. “Reverence” is definitely the title of the primary chapter of my e book and since that phrase is simply, I believe it must be the start as a result of I believe if we actually wish to change the world, we’ve to vary individuals’s worldviews. And spirituality is type of this very loaded phrase, largely as a consequence of faith, nevertheless it’s primarily simply one thing that comes right down to our worldview and the way we see life and this expertise that we’re a part of. 

And, I believe the extra time you spend embedded within the pure world and learning the pure world, it’s so awe-inspiring. And I believe that has extra of an influence to shift individuals than a statistic or a truth or a determine. And each of your photos actually, actually seize that. And that reverence additionally conjures up hope since you see how a lot resilience the pure world is able to. You see what individuals are able to once we truly get within the water. So I really like that you simply centered on these two phrases.

Cristina

We do that work as a result of we wish to dwell on a planet that is filled with wildlife, that is filled with Indigenous data, the place everyone has equal rights and everyone’s welcome and included, and the place a handful of individuals are not in command of each choice on everyone else. So that’s the planet I wish to dwell in. And I’m going to manifest that future with my work every single day.

Willow

Whether it’s deep-sea diving or spending time on the polls, are there ever any moments the place you’re feeling actually afraid on task?

Paul

You’re by no means afraid, however you’re centered. And I’ve crashed two airplanes, however once I crashed my second airplane, I had left the wheels down on my floats. And at 70 miles an hour, I ended the other way up in a lake, an Arctic lake, stuffed with water within the cockpit, and it’s a 99% fatality charge, however we’ve had so many scary moments underwater that you simply’re like, “OK, I need to focus through this right now and I need to use whatever lessons I’ve had in life to get through this,” otherwise you don’t. And I believe what’s neat concerning the work we do is the more severe it will get, the scarier it will get, the calmer you get, the extra centered you get. And we’ve run out of air underwater. We received caught in a giant down present final yr in New Zealand the place there was a giant nice white shark round. It’s so humorous.

When I first met Cristina, I used to be on lecture tour and I used to be so proud and I simply spoke to 2,800 individuals on the Benaroya Hall and I received up on stage and I had some good tales, nevertheless it was largely, “I nearly died here and I did this and this bad thing happened to me, but I’m a hero.” And I received off stage and I used to be like, “Did you like my talk?” And I used to be so proud. She goes, “Do you really need to spend an hour telling everybody how big your balls are?” And I used to be devastated, however she was proper. And now the tales are far more centered on, after all you’ve had these moments, however you don’t actually give attention to these. You’re simply so grateful for having the possibility to do that work, to inform these tales, to attach with international audiences, to provoke a motion, that that’s a lot extra rewarding than kind of … But yeah, we’ve had some moments, however you simply get centered.

Cristina

I’ll let you know what, I imply, you realize that if you’re not a bit of scared, if you’re not a bit of uncomfortable, you’re in all probability not in the suitable place. And we each have been misplaced at sea if you come up from a dive and rapidly there’s no boat there and also you’re drifting alone questioning what’s going to occur subsequent. And then like Paul mentioned, you focus, you discover options and also you get rescued: miraculous. Or was it final yr, Paul, or the yr earlier than that, that we each had been—it’s not an assault from a proper whale, however put in our place by a strong proper whale who mentioned, “You’re too close, find your boundaries.” And it’s terrifying when such a giant animal will get curious or will get assertive with you.

Paul

Well, each these circumstances with the southern proper whales, they had been inquisitive about us. And we’re simply sitting there within the ocean and this calf who occurs to be with Cristina, this calf was a younger calf, nevertheless it’s nonetheless in all probability 10,000 kilos, it needed to go play together with her. So it got here taking pictures over her. And the mom, she doesn’t have arms, so she’s making an attempt to regulate her calf and determined that she couldn’t management her calf. So the one method to—I may see her loading up her tail and her tail weighs greater than a suburban pickup truck, weighs greater than a car. And she’s received this 20-foot-wide tail, and she or he’s loading it up and I may see her cocking—Cristina’s watching the calf and she or he throws her tail at Cristina. I grabbed her and I yelled, “Duck!” and she or he put her head underwater and the tail went taking pictures—it will’ve taken her head off.

And then that was it. But the mother’s identical to, that’s her simply saying, “Hey, I can’t control my kids.” So in her world it’s in all probability a really minor second, however for Cristina, it may have been demise. And then I had a subadult 35-foot-long southern proper whale who determined that it was going to return and play with me. And it didn’t notice how ineffective I’m within the water. So I freedove down. It got here towards me and it needed to play. It was in all probability used to enjoying with dolphins. And she simply got here up and rammed me. And rapidly it pushed me down together with her chin and she or he’s making an attempt to push me towards the sand and I’m making an attempt to get some air. So I attempted to swim up and she or he hit me down once more. And then she hit me together with her peck, which is, once more, the dimensions of a hood of a automotive.

Yeah. So these are moments the place once more, you’re craving air, you’re pushed down towards the underside, and you bought to only kind of hold your calm. It’s like virtually every part that kills divers is panic.

Cristina

It’s additionally to say that there’s a craze of egocentric individuals desirous to be photographed with whales and with dolphins. And these are wild animals that want house. And I imply, if the story serves to say something, is like, you might get actually harm. So give animals house, don’t chase them and definitely take note of what they’re doing as a result of they’re people. And typically they wish to play. Sometimes they’re having a nasty day. Sometimes they only don’t have any endurance for people and it could possibly find yourself poorly.

Paul

And we’ve to let the animals at all times dictate the encounter. There’s nothing worse than a pressured animal. That’s not why we do that work. We do it as a result of we actually wish to give them a voice, put their points in—we use charismatic megafauna to raise their points which might be affecting their habitat and their ecosystem. So you want a relaxed, relaxed, blissful animal. And so by simply spending quiet, mild time with these animals, after which allow them to dictate the encounter, you’ve these actually highly effective non secular moments in nature that actually, it comes via within the images, these intimate, intimate moments.

Willow

And they sound deeply humbling, too.

Paul

Yeah. Yeah, positively.

Cristina

One final thought, the work that we do is humbling for positive. And I really feel like each time we get within the water, we’re signing a contract that claims, “I’m willing to die,” as a result of it’s so out of your arms. The ocean is such a strong pressure and animals, they don’t have written contracts on how one can behave. And it’s lots to ask a creature to average its feelings if you’re within the water. So if it’s the way in which we go, it’s the way in which we go.

Paul

But it’s wonderful simply on social media, if you watch—Cristina talked about this selfie craze that’s occurring with people who find themselves so ignorant and uneducated and unaware strolling as much as wild animals with their little selfie sticks, whether or not it’s a bison or a bear or no matter it’s. And you’re identical to, “My God, animals are forgiving.” And but we vilify them once we’re petrified of them and we hate wolves and we run them down and we hate bears and we hate—We’re such a scared species and we hate something that we’re petrified of. 

And but you watch these animals time and time, once more, simply forgive us for our ignorance and allow us to off the hook. And it’s unbelievable. People are like, “Aren’t you scared of bears?” I imply, I’ve seen 3,000 polar bears, 2,000 grizzly bears, 1,000 black bears, and I’ve by no means had a scary second. And if there ever was a second that was a bit of bit off, it’s as a result of I tousled. I’d let my guard down or I wasn’t paying consideration or I received too shut, nevertheless it’s simply these animals are so forgiving. It’s unbelievable.

Willow

OK. So we’ve a number of crashed planes, virtually drowning in a cockpit. We have getting caught in an undercurrent, and there being an important white shark. We have Cristina virtually being decapitated. We have operating out of oxygen. You talked about that panic is the factor that actually kills divers. So I’m pondering, on this second, these type of anxiety-inducing instances, what knowledge do it’s important to share about overcoming nervousness and panic?

Cristina

God, nervousness is such an epidemic. And I, once more, suppose that the antidote to nervousness is motion. And in case you don’t wish to really feel fearful and anxious, it’s important to rise up and do one thing. And it virtually doesn’t matter what it’s. Write a letter, decide up the telephone, name a senator, go protest, march, discuss to a neighbor. Any type of motion is an antidote to nervousness, and recoiling into ourselves and into social media might be the worst factor we will do.

Paul

Because we’re free divers, we do quite a lot of breath maintain work and we free dive right down to first rate depths, and also you’re spending time down there with sperm whales and blue whales. And to coach for that’s twice a day, we’ll do some breath coaching and simply breathe in for 4 seconds after which out for eight. And you notice in a short time the way it takes you out of your busy mind. And it’s wonderful if you calm your self, how every part turns into very clear round you and your path ahead turns into clear. And then rapidly, you’re on this lovely journey and also you’re making a distinction on the planet. And nothing feels pretty much as good as making a distinction and being a part of a much bigger motion, a much bigger neighborhood to advance the well being of our planet.

Willow

OK. Final query. How has your partnership deepened your understanding of what it means to like not simply one another, but in addition the planet?

Cristina

I’m going to say that we each had these first marriages and lots of people are caught in a primary marriage the place you’re studying how one can be associate and also you make quite a lot of errors. And for me, I used to be married for 20, 21 years to any individual who was not the suitable associate for me. So once I met Paul and I had this coming collectively of not simply the souls and the our bodies, the entire thrilling issues about being in love, but in addition any individual with a shared goal, any individual who understands precisely why I’ve to get on an airplane and go someplace—I want to do that work. I’ve no selection. It’s so rewarding. And I believe for photographers, particularly, it’s a really lonely journey. So I’m every single day grateful that I get to share this with Paul.

And I do know that I’m going to spend the remainder of my life doing it with him and it’s the perfect factor.

Paul

She comes into this relationship and this journey we’re on very a lot in service to the journey that we’re doing collectively. And it actually kind of was a tradition shock to me as a result of I come from a world of tit-for-tat relationships. I cook dinner the dinner, you do the dishes, I do this. And it’s rapidly, right here’s this girl who’s giving every part to me and throwing herself at our widespread objective on this journey. So rapidly, you get up at some point and also you’re like, “I got to give back to this person.” And additionally if you begin to get up and also you wait, your first query is, “How do I make her day better? How am I in service to this person, this partner in my life? How do we have this common goal of making this a better planet together? How do we live a life of purpose and passion?” And to have this for me has been probably the most lovely reward to only at all times take into consideration, how do you give again.

Cristina

But additionally, I don’t care in case you get up alone or with any individual, however simply dedicate the primary 5 minutes of your day to share some gratitude, to do some affirmations concerning the the explanation why you’re collectively and the aim of the day as an alternative of reaching to your telephone and the information and the social media repair, as a result of it adjustments the narrative of your day in such a strong means. And yeah, every single day I get to say to Paul, “I’m really grateful that I get to spend the rest of my life with you.”

Willow

Love is what teaches us to rise up within the morning and be of service and to ask that query of, how can I make the world higher right now? Not simply how can I make the lifetime of this individual higher right now? And I really like what you’re pointing to, Paul, across the shift from a tradition of kind of extractive trade of giving with the expectation of receiving versus simply giving together with your entire coronary heart. And in doing that, after all you can be fed in return.

Cristina

Same to you, Willow. I imply, you present up right here with such articulate, lovely questions and also you simply made our day and such a pleasure to be working with you.

Willow

Well, likewise, and possibly subsequent time you’re on the present, Paul, you possibly can put together your proposal.

Willow

Stay tuned for half two.

Narration

Most of us don’t usually discover ourselves practically drowning in a cockpit within the Arctic or virtually getting decapitated by a whale in the course of the ocean, however I believe all of us expertise moments of overwhelm, significantly because it pertains to the state of our world. I do know that for me personally, in these moments, it’s my relationships that get me via. So in strolling away from this episode, I invite you to consider who the individuals are in your life, whether or not it’s a associate or a buddy or a colleague, that you may lean on and switch to if you really feel overwhelmed, and in addition what it’d seem like so that you can place love extra immediately on the heart of your work and the way in which you progress via the world.

The Nature Of is an Atmos podcast produced by Jesse Baker and Eric Newsom of Magnificent Noise. Our manufacturing employees contains Emmanuel Hapsis and Sabrina Farhi. Our sound designer is Kristen Mueller. Our government producers are me, Willow Defebaugh, Theresa Perez, Jake Sargent, and Eric Newsom. Atmos is a nonprofit that seeks to reenchant individuals with our shared humanity and the earth via inventive storytelling. To assist our work or this podcast, see our present notes or go to atmos.earth/biome. That’s A-T-M-O-S dot earth, slash B-I-O-M-E. I’m your host, Willow Defebaugh, and that is The Nature Of.